The Russian Mosin Nagant Forum

Got the info somewhere, but can't find it to save my soul, either here on on-line. The cocking knobs of Russian/Soviet Mosin bolts were scalloped on the bottom for some time in addition to the normal knurling. When did this practice stop? I want to say in the 30's, but just a WAG.

I don't know if it stopped with M91s or Dragoons. It is an older feature regardless.

befus wrote:Got the info somewhere, but can't find it to save my soul, either here on on-line. The cocking knobs of Russian/Soviet Mosin bolts were scalloped on the bottom for some time in addition to the normal knurling. When did this practice stop? I want to say in the 30's, but just a WAG.

Izhevsk - 1941, together with other wartime simplifications, Tula - end of 1942

I don't know what you mean here. Do you have a picture of scallops and knurling?

bunkysdad wrote:I don't know what you mean here. Do you have a picture of scallops and knurling?

If he's talking about the bottom 1/3 of the knob Looking "ground off" on the larger knob's, were mostly Imperial weren't they?

That is kind of what I am thinking here. But in my mind I am thinking of a Mauser bolt with a actual knurled flattened cocking knob. Quite a beautiful feature in my opinion.

Kinda odd. I have guys saying from 20's or 30's, to wartime simplifications at Izh in '41 and Tula in '42?????? Checking some other sites to see if the opinions there differ.

befus wrote:Kinda odd. I have guys saying from 20's or 30's, to wartime simplifications at Izh in '41 and Tula in '42?????? Checking some other sites to see if the opinions there differ.

Just look at factory matching rifles and everything will be obvious.

I've got matching Tula's 36-40 and all have the smaller, perfectly round cocking knobs

Ratnik wrote:

befus wrote:Kinda odd. I have guys saying from 20's or 30's, to wartime simplifications at Izh in '41 and Tula in '42?????? Checking some other sites to see if the opinions there differ.

Just look at factory matching rifles and everything will be obvious.

Befus, I always thought this change, like many changes, took place around 1928. I was told wrong and, and the new info being discovered and published by Ratnik has changed a lot of old school "facts" Ratnik knows best! . I really enjoyed his first mosin book and am looking forward to his next. Denny

steelbuttplate wrote:I've got matching Tula's 36-40 and all have the smaller, perfectly round cocking knobs

Most 91-30's we encounter were force matched or rematched during the refurb process, and then stored away until we could enjoy them years and years later . The refirb's will have any number of different parts on them and will not most likely not be the same as when the rifle left the factory(factory matching as Ratnik stated vs a matching refirb). If your '36-'40 Tulas are factory matching then my hats off to you,....I have come across very few in 20 years of collecting. Denny

I'm not sure, but 4 out of 5 of these rifles parts have the same font, the same peculiarity of spacing, leaning numbers, etc. to make you think they were stamped by the same machine on the same day. Also no sign of numbers being ground off of the bolt. They are old imports, with small import marks at the muzzle. What distinguishes factory matching parts?

None of my. M91's or M91/30's are factory matching, but my 47 Russian M44 and my 54 Romanian M44 are factory matching. I'd be surprised if I found a factory matching M91/30.

steelbuttplate wrote:I've got matching Tula's 36-40 and all have the smaller, perfectly round cocking knobs

Here are two factory matching 1938 Tula's. Rifle in better condition have questionable type, it's not clear from pictures, but worn rifle clearly have early pattern cocking knob
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread. ... -pic-heavy

Matching 1939 Tula. Early pattern cocking knob
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread. ... ng-numbers

Factory matching early 1942 Tula. Early pattern cocking knob
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread. ... rb-42-Tula

Factory matching late 1939 Izhevsk M91/30. Early pattern cocking knob
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread. ... g-MN-91-30

Factory matching mid 1940 Izhevsk M91/30. Early pattern cocking knob
https://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=170282

Factory matching early 1941 Izhevsk M38. Early pattern cocking knob
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread. ... M38-gamble

When I wrote dates of changes introduction, I mean periods when they were officially adopted (I have documents, so called "lists of changes"). But I know few cases when production of changes was started earlier than their adoption (good sample is 'stamped" stock nose cap, that was produced by Tula since mid 1920's, officially adopted in 1939, and Izhevsk started it's production only in 1941).
So if somebody will post pre 1941 factory original matching rifle with late pattern cocking knob, this will be interesting

I will work on putting 3 on here. I don't know that they are matching or refurbed, but I am curious as well.

Thanks for all the info, much appreciated.