1960 GM

[awalker1829]

This baby is my project at the museum. Original 1960 General Motors TGH-3102. Delivered in October, 1960 to Old Pueblo Transit Company of Tucson, Arizona. Gas engine needs an overhaul-nothing our volunteers can't do. We actually have a complete spare drive train and unmachined engine block for it. Coach was retired in 1974 and sold to a guy that was going to do an RV conversion on it. Fortunately, the coach was resold to another owner who was a driver for Tucson Rapid Transit before any real damage could be done-only a couple of seats were removed. He located replacements and so the coach interior is 99% original. Michigan lights will eventually be removed as they were not original to the coach and are not legally required.

[Junk Yard Dog]

It looks like it's in good shape, or course out there rust wouldn't be as big an issue. I have a similar type and age bus out on the lot that was used for parts storage years ago, it is so badly rusted it might soon collapse under it's own rust.

[Miller Tyme]

Looks great for something that is a month older than me.

[awalker1829]

It looks like it's in good shape, or course out there rust wouldn't be as big an issue. I have a similar type and age bus out on the lot that was used for parts storage years ago, it is so badly rusted it might soon collapse under it's own rust.

What rust? No rust anywhere other than a teeny bit of surface rust underneath. The biggest pain is caked dust and dried grease. We have thirty plus coaches that are being moved to our new storage and maintenance facility. Some are just out of service and others are in varying degrees of integrity (or lack thereof). Most of our coaches are from Arizona, so rust is not the deciding factor in what gets saved.



This is the quality of work that our crew is capable of putting out. This is our first completed restoration project-1938 Yellow Coach Model 1204 built for the Warren Bisbee Lines in Bisbee, Arizona. When we obtained it, it was a shell on a bad frame sitting in St. David's, Arizona on a ranch. We obtained the frame of sister coach No. 7 and used to restore No. 8. As usual, it works fine when we're puttering around but when we need it to work, it breaks down.

Our current restoration projects are a 1928 Twin Coach and a 1946 Ford Transit Coach. The Twin was built for Warren Bisbee Lines as their No. 1 and the Ford was built for the Tucson Rapid Transit Company. We have four newer Sun Tran coaches (City of Tucson, Arizona) that will eventually be restored to as delivered or as retired condition (markings, etc.). The city has had a long term unwritten understanding that when an entire class of coach is retired, one of the better condition units is set aside and donated to Old Pueblo Trolley along with whatever parts and manuals are on hand. We have most of the service manuals and many parts books for the coaches that are undergoing restoration (I have all of the books for the TGH-3102). We also have the GM parts number to vendor parts number book.

[Junk Yard Dog]

What happened to the frame to make it bad if rust was not a factor? Cracks?

[awalker1829]

Cracked/broken frame on the No. 8. Fortunately, they also had the body of the No. 7 complete with frame so we swapped parts out. We call it No. 8 though more accurately it should be No. 7 and a half. The fact that some locals used it for target practice didn't help matters. At least they didn't set it on fire.

[Junk Yard Dog]

Frame swap, now that's a job and a half, but at least it gives an opportunity to clean, inspect, and then paint every component attached to the frame and the frame itself. Around here a broken frame is rare, no frame makes it long enough to break before it rusts to pieces first.

[awalker1829]

Indeed. At least we're fortunate enough that we have a library of tech, parts and service manuals for most of the coaches. Makes it a hell of a lot easier to do things when you have information to refer to. Incidentally, the local Pontiac club loves to have the Yellow Coach and GM Old Look displayed at their meets-both of them were built in Pontiac.

[Junk Yard Dog]

With the steering wheel set so far in front of the front wheels there must be some complicated linkage under there. How is it steering this around corners and such?

[awalker1829]

Steering is fine. Thing to remember is that it does not have power steering, so when you are making a turn starting from a dead stop, you want to turn the wheel slightly before stopping. Toeing the wheel makes it easier to complete the turn. Otherwise you have to overcome friction which requires a good deal of physical effort.

[awalker1829]

December update on the GM TGH-3102. I just secured a donation that will cover the cost of bodywork and paint for Old Pueblo Transit Company No. 135. We are starting the bodywork now and hope to have the exterior paint done in the next couple of months. Livery that is currently on the bus is very similar to, but not totally correct for this coach, so the correct livery will be applied. Interior of the coach needs fresh paint, but that isn't really that bad. Engine has been overhauled but there are still a few things that could use attention.

[millman]

I found this picture on my local FB history page. Thought it might be of interest on this thread.

15327408_1453320211363827_1911662285848466750_n.jpg

[awalker1829]

It is interesting. Our Yellow Coach is a Model 1204.

[awalker1829]

Well, I spent the day down at the shop doing body prep on the GM. The weekday guys did a good job tackling the worst dents and I ground the surfaces down in preparation for applying body filler. The other man followed along behind me, applying the filler. Due to the temperature, the filler is taking longer to set. We had hoped to give it a rough sanding today, but decided to put that off until Monday. The Michigan lights were removed and the associated holes sanded so that the weekday guys can patch them. Off next weekend for Christmas but we'll be working New Year's Eve.

As to the TGH-3102 and Yellow Coach, their steering linkages are basic. You wanna see complicated? I'll post a photo of the steering column of our Aerocoach highway coach. It will blow your minds. It is-to be quite frank-bizarre. Why the engineers made it so complicated is beyond me. You'll have to see it to believe it.

[Junk Yard Dog]

Easy, unsupervised engineers . I watched while one redesigned a simple winch setup five times getting more complex each time. Each "fix" was to correct a minor problem only the engineer thought could be improved. In the end there is a $7500 winch setup made to haul a small cart up a flight of stairs on rails built into the side of the steps leading down to a water filled pit were divers are testing equipment. Walking up and down the stairs with tanks and such was replaced with a simple drag sled and harbor freight winch running off a car battery. Now two years later the winch is a heavy duty marvel of modern technology complete with redundant safety systems costing more than my car, powered by the mains and attached to a post sunk in a concrete pylon weighing 7000 pounds pulling a cart that is a custom machined masterpiece ( also redesigned and rebuilt several times). I had to shift things around so they could get the concrete truck in there. Anyone who thinks I shelled out for that you can forget it, all to save a small bit of labor on occasional weekend diving operations on property they don't own and pay to use. Oh, I forgot, the post is set 1-2 degrees off center so now the engineer is custom making a special bracket to correct this glaring deficiency so the cable runs perfectly straight down the stairs. I just nodded when he told me that one, the "defect" can only be detected with special instruments, not seen with the eye, whatever, not my money, don't know who's, but not mine.

[awalker1829]

I'll take a picture of the steering column and send it to you, JYD. Seriously, the thing is curved and has at least seven coupled links. We did have to rebuild the steering box on the Yellow Coach Model 1204 due to a part failing. Fortunately, we have enough machinists and engineers in our ranks that most anything is technically possible.

[awalker1829]

Update on the 1960 GM bus-we've pretty much wrapped up the engine repairs and have finished bodywork in preparation for repainting. Over the next few weeks, we'll repaint it to its correct transit livery. Better yet, it'll have a historically appropriate license tag. Arizona permits antique motor vehicle owners to register their antique vehicles with the department of transportation using antique license plates as long as the number is unassigned, the plate is the correct class for the vehicle and the year the plate was issued matches the model year of the vehicle. Arizona only issued new plates in odd years at that time, so we were looking for a Class C-2 1959 commercial license plate with a 1960 tab. I located one with an unassigned number that was for sale and got in communication with the seller. Once the bus is painted, I'll post photos.

[millman]

[ffuries]

Can't wait to see the pictures. So what will the next project be?

[awalker1829]

I don't really know at this point. As part of our mission is to train vocational students, I would like to fix up our 1994 Neoplan. It originally ran on CNG but was eventually rebuilt with a heavy Diesel engine. It's onboard systems are fairly modern and what mechanics willl encounter in a real shop-good training for our trainees will run ibto