The Russian Mosin Nagant Forum

Howdy Y'all ..

Scrubbing the bore of my Izhevsk M38 refurb, I discovered the bores muzzle end is recessed for about an inch or so from the crown to where the rifling begins..There is an obvious shoulder there, leaving the last inch or so smoothbore.... Any know why?
Grenade launching only thing that come so mind...I dunno...Thanks.

I'll leave the explanation to the forums here . But this is kind of what you are talking about.

Yep...One picture is worth a thousand words. Thanks for posting.

It is counter bored to put a new crown on a worn muzzle, without having to cut the barrel back. Very common.

We would like to see pics of the whole rifle though. Welcome aboard.

Ahhhhhh....Makes good sense to me...Thanks. Ill get some pics of the 38 soon. The 91 is on loan to a buddy and may take a little longer..

JRO233 wrote:Howdy Y'all ..

Scrubbing the bore of my Izhevsk M38 refurb, I discovered the bores muzzle end is recessed for about an inch or so from the crown to where the rifling begins..There is an obvious shoulder there, leaving the last inch or so smoothbore.... Any know why?
Grenade launching only thing that come so mind...I dunno...Thanks.

Sounds like you are from the south and a big welcome to the board from Mississippi. You have found a great resource for Mosin information and a bunch of great guys to boot.

Absolutely...Across the Mississippi in Louisiana..West of the Red and East of the Sabine...Thanks for the warm welcome....

JRO233 wrote:Absolutely...Across the Mississippi in Louisiana..West of the Red and East of the Sabine...Thanks for the warm welcome....

Welcome aboard from Claiborne Parish.

DeSoto is where I'm hanging my hat...

Called counter boring it was frowned upon by some nations but it was a perfect way to solve an eroded worn crown on a well used barrel and thereby return the accuracy of the rifle. The cause of the loss of the crown or loss of accuracy was the soldiers use of a steel cleaning rod from the muzzle end of the rifle. This is why most people clean from the chamber end of the barrel if possible and use an alternative cleaning rod to the steel the soldiers used.

Anybody with a handle of B24 (the Liberator bomber is one of my favorite's) has got to be an OK guy! I also need to fly on one yet as it is one of the ones I have only been on board and not flown on yet. Welcome aboard and enjoy the experience! Bill

Thanks Bill...I always clean from the chamber when possible...I first discovered the muzzle was oversized when searching for a correct size brush I stuck one in the muzzle to check fit...I assumed some Russian conscript ramming a steel rod up and down had worn out the crown..HA! Never occurred they would have counter bored.

Actually quite common practice, I had it done to a Danish Garand barrel to clean up, and it improved it a lot....

I have several rifles with the counter bore like yours and they shoot very good. Welcome to the forum.

Thanks bunkysdad... When I bought the M-38 about 6 years ago I also got a sealed zinc can of WWII surplus ammo for $39+shp...the old stuff was highly inaccurate...couldn't hit the vodka warehouse door...Recently a friend gave me couple boxes of more modern ammo...Huge difference in accuracy. Still not a MOA piece, but OK for fun ...

zeebill wrote:Called counter boring it was frowned upon by some nations but it was a perfect way to solve an eroded worn crown on a well used barrel and thereby return the accuracy of the rifle. The cause of the loss of the crown or loss of accuracy was the soldiers use of a steel cleaning rod from the muzzle end of the rifle. This is why most people clean from the chamber end of the barrel if possible and use an alternative cleaning rod to the steel the soldiers used.

Anybody with a handle of B24 (the Liberator bomber is one of my favorite's) has got to be an OK guy! I also need to fly on one yet as it is one of the ones I have only been on board and not flown on yet. Welcome aboard and enjoy the experience! Bill

Hey Zeebill, my username is in honor of my Dad. He was a B24/B25 ( mainly B24) crew chief (mechanic) during WW2. I'm a fan of the 24 also, the 17 got all the glory and I've always thought the 24 got a bum rap. More 24s were built than any other plane during the war. I have 93 year old Uncle that's still living that flew 78 missions in the South Pacific on the 24. An interesting thing Dad did before being deployed to North Africa then to Italy was to service the B25s that Doolittle flew off aircraft carrier on the raid on Tokyo. He always commented that the B25 was a sweet flying plane. Daddy also had a brother that died on a 17 over Germany. The WW2 vets are sadly leaving us at an alarming rate.

B24 wrote:

zeebill wrote: Hey Zeebill, my username is in honor of my Dad. He was a B24/B25 ( mainly B24) crew chief (mechanic) during WW2. I'm a fan of the 24 also, the 17 got all the glory and I've always thought the 24 got a bum rap. More 24s were built than any other plane during the war. I have 93 year old Uncle that's still living that flew 78 missions in the South Pacific on the 24. An interesting thing Dad did before being deployed to North Africa then to Italy was to service the B25s that Doolittle flew off aircraft carrier on the raid on Tokyo. He always commented that the B25 was a sweet flying plane. Daddy also had a brother that died on a 17 over Germany. The WW2 vets are sadly leaving us at an alarming rate.

That's cool. My grandfather flew PB4Ys during part of his time in the Navy. However, I believe that most of his time in the Pacific Theatre was flying TBM Avengers with STAG One. On the other side of the family, I had a great uncle who was a mechanic in England working on 17s. He was decorated during his time, but would never say what for.