The Russian Mosin Nagant Forum

There aren't a lot of hundred year old military surplus guns which can look this good.

But the Argentine M1909 is one of them.

Not a lot more to say that the pics won't tell. Enjoy, and thanks for looking.

Many consider the Argentine 1909 as the high point of Mauser fit and finish, they are probably right. When I look at mine I am just amazed that something this nicely made was intended for ordinary soldiers. I fought a small war for this rifle, it hung for years on the wall of a gunshop like Chuck works in. One were all the real cool stuff is hanging up and not for sale. One day the owner decided to sell out and retire, there would be a one day super sale of all the remaining stock, including all the stuff on the walls. I found out a local Bubba was planning on buying that 1909 GEW and reworking it into a " good" sporter, he never could keep his mouth shut. I got up before dawn, I was in that parking lot waiting when the shop owner arrived just as the sun was coming up. We had coffee, spent some time chatting about days gone by, then I bought that Mauser and a number of other nice things. I am packing it all into the car when Bubba pulls in, first thing he sees is me with that rifle. He was a blustery sort who thought if you talk loud enough you get what you want. First he offered money, then accused me of going " behind his back " to steal the rifle from him. I said yes, that's just what I did, and his eyes about popped out of his skull. Then I opened my coat and made sure he saw what I had on my belt, we had a few quiet words that ended the conversation and I spent the next five years stealing out from under that scumbag any rifle I heard he was looking at, or for. I am sure a few slipped past me, but for the most part he had to travel away from home to find what he wanted. It all ended on the side of I-95 someplace in Georgia when local, state, and Federal law enforcement swooped down on him and his trunk full of guns and blow he was running north. Smuggling hand guns into New York was a big no-no back then also, unregistered full auto weapons an even bigger no-no as was the several keys of blow, major distribution weight. Couldn't happen to a nicer guy, I hope he enjoys the special relationships with his fellow inmates that prison life has to offer, I hope he enjoys it several times a day. Every time I look at that Mauser I think of that Bubba, I like to say he started going bad the moment he took a saw to his first milsurp, and look were he ended up.

Congratulations - a very nice Mauser. A 1909 Argentine Mauser also stands far on top of my wish list, only surpassed by a Swiss K31. Normally it isn't too difficult to find a real nice, all-matching one over here, but I'm looking for one with matching bayonet, too. And that's a different story...

7x57 wrote:Congratulations - a very nice Mauser. A 1909 Argentine Mauser also stands far on top of my wish list, only surpassed by a Swiss K31. Normally it isn't too difficult to find a real nice, all-matching one over here, but I'm looking for one with matching bayonet, too. And that's a different story...

Available in Germany or are you buying from other European country's also? The Argentine government sold off the bulk of these rifles during the late 1950's and into the early 60's. I wouldn't have thought Germany was a big importer of surplus like this at that time. Argentina had a nice program of refurbishment going on aimed at squeezing as much money as they could from their surplus rifles. They made them look pretty before they offered them for sale in order to command top dollar. They did it with everything going back to the Remington 1879 Rolling block, but these unissued, or lightly issued 1909's slipped past that. They looked good enough as is , I had a hell of a time finding a nice original 1879 that had escaped refurb.

7x57 wrote:Congratulations - a very nice Mauser. A 1909 Argentine Mauser also stands far on top of my wish list, only surpassed by a Swiss K31. Normally it isn't too difficult to find a real nice, all-matching one over here, but I'm looking for one with matching bayonet, too. And that's a different story...

Here's to hoping you can find one that is nearly as nice as your No.4 Mk2.

Junk Yard Dog wrote:Available in Germany or are you buying from other European country's also?

So far I did only buy from German sources. It IS possible to buy from other EU countries plus Switzerland, but as soon as you can't pick up the rifle by yourself transport becomes rather expensive. And of course a lot of paper work...

European, South American (mainly from Brazil, Argentina, Chile and Peru) and Persian Mausers, Mosin-Nagants (Russian, Hungarian, Polish, Finnish), Swiss G11s, K11s, K31s, British Lee-Enfields, Italian Carcanos, French MAS 36s and Lebels, and Austrian Steyr-Mannlichers are normally no problem to find here in a wide variety of models, condition and (of course) prices - not always exactly when you are looking for one, but with a little bit of patience normally no problem. Especially long Hungarian Mosin-Nagants which are extremely rare in the US are quite frequently found here in good to near-new condition for prices seldom exceeding 250 Euros. On the other hand we very rarely encounter a Japanese Arisaka - and if, normally in rather sad condition. Similar is with M1903 Springfields - they are relatively rare, quite expensive and in nearly every case more or less refurbished - making up good shooters in most cases, but nothing special from a collector's viewpoint.

Most milsurp rifles imported by Germany came in the time frame early 1970s to mid-1990s. This can easily be traced from the German proof dates found on most of these rifles. Main importer was "Frankonia" (head office at Würzburg/Bavaria), still the largest distributer for hunting, outdoor and sport shooting equipment here in Germany. And now the collector generation who bought these freshly-imported rifles in the 1970s or early 1980s is more and more selling their collections - so a lot of fine piece come on the market to (for the most part at least) reasonable prices. However, fine K98ks always command a premium - this type simply (and understandably) has a certain "cult status" here in Germany.

The Arisaka and the M1903 I can see would be hard, the Arisaka rifle's we have are mainly rifles captured during the Pacific war and brought home. There were surplus imports off and on after the war also. The M1903 was never sold on the surplus market outside of the US, they were sold to US citizens, and given to our allies during the war as part of the lend lease program. Germany and Austria as well as other countries did receive some US weapons after the war, but I don't believe the '03 was among that lot. The '03 is a mauser family rifle and Germany would have had enough Mauser's after the war even with what the Soviets took. Hungary must have been on better economic footing that some other former east block nations after 1989 as they don't seem to have dumped much of their surplus on us other than some SKS rifles, and later new made rifles. Canada got some Hungarian 91/30's, but in the US I only see Hungarian PU's and then rarely, the Hungarian M44 is more common but these were Romanian imports.

That is a gorgeous '09, one of them is on my short list of things to buy.. In the last few months, I have picked up three Argentine '91s, two of which are in nearly that condition, excepting the scrubbed barrel shank. The other one of the 91s was absolutely pristine, until some bubba sob cut 12" off the stock. If anyone sees a '91 stock floating about, let me know.

I was gifted an 09 like that. Had cosmoline in the barrel. The clear kind, as opposed to the red/brown commie cosmoline I was used to dealing with. It is the only rifle I have that I have not shot.


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390ish wrote:I was gifted an 09 like that. Had cosmoline in the barrel. The clear kind, as opposed to the red/brown commie cosmoline I was used to dealing with. It is the only rifle I have that I have not shot.


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That red brown crap the commies used, and the clear stuff the Argentines used is grease, cheap grease. Cosmoline is our stuff, the product of a first world capitalist economy, it is heated to liquefy it, applied to metal with a brush like paint, allowed to dry to a wax like dark coating. Grease wipes off, usually on everything you don't want it on, it's also absorbed by wood and will leach out every time the wood gets hot. Cosmoline will not be absorbed by anything once it's dry, it's also considerably more expensive that grease, that's why we could use it and they couldn't afford to. 7.65 Argentine is hard to find, Surplus exists in small amounts, but then so does commercial loads for almost the same money.

WOW! That is absolutely perfect. What a great addition to your collection.

Almost forgot...

... it isn't matching to the gun, but it's almost as pretty.

Nice

Junk Yard Dog wrote:Many consider the Argentine 1909 as the high point of Mauser fit and finish, they are probably right. When I look at mine I am just amazed that something this nicely made was intended for ordinary soldiers. I fought a small war for this rifle, it hung for years on the wall of a gunshop like Chuck works in. One were all the real cool stuff is hanging up and not for sale. One day the owner decided to sell out and retire, there would be a one day super sale of all the remaining stock, including all the stuff on the walls. I found out a local Bubba was planning on buying that 1909 GEW and reworking it into a " good" sporter, he never could keep his mouth shut. I got up before dawn, I was in that parking lot waiting when the shop owner arrived just as the sun was coming up. We had coffee, spent some time chatting about days gone by, then I bought that Mauser and a number of other nice things. I am packing it all into the car when Bubba pulls in, first thing he sees is me with that rifle. He was a blustery sort who thought if you talk loud enough you get what you want. First he offered money, then accused me of going " behind his back " to steal the rifle from him. I said yes, that's just what I did, and his eyes about popped out of his skull. Then I opened my coat and made sure he saw what I had on my belt, we had a few quiet words that ended the conversation and I spent the next five years stealing out from under that scumbag any rifle I heard he was looking at, or for. I am sure a few slipped past me, but for the most part he had to travel away from home to find what he wanted. It all ended on the side of I-95 someplace in Georgia when local, state, and Federal law enforcement swooped down on him and his trunk full of guns and blow he was running north. Smuggling hand guns into New York was a big no-no back then also, unregistered full auto weapons an even bigger no-no as was the several keys of blow, major distribution weight. Couldn't happen to a nicer guy, I hope he enjoys the special relationships with his fellow inmates that prison life has to offer, I hope he enjoys it several times a day. Every time I look at that Mauser I think of that Bubba, I like to say he started going bad the moment he took a saw to his first milsurp, and look were he ended up.

And the moral of the story is STAY ON JYD's GOOD SIDE!

Martin,
Well done.............AGAIN!!!! Another beautiful rifle.

websterz wrote:

Junk Yard Dog wrote:Many consider the Argentine 1909 as the high point of Mauser fit and finish, they are probably right. When I look at mine I am just amazed that something this nicely made was intended for ordinary soldiers. I fought a small war for this rifle, it hung for years on the wall of a gunshop like Chuck works in. One were all the real cool stuff is hanging up and not for sale. One day the owner decided to sell out and retire, there would be a one day super sale of all the remaining stock, including all the stuff on the walls. I found out a local Bubba was planning on buying that 1909 GEW and reworking it into a " good" sporter, he never could keep his mouth shut. I got up before dawn, I was in that parking lot waiting when the shop owner arrived just as the sun was coming up. We had coffee, spent some time chatting about days gone by, then I bought that Mauser and a number of other nice things. I am packing it all into the car when Bubba pulls in, first thing he sees is me with that rifle. He was a blustery sort who thought if you talk loud enough you get what you want. First he offered money, then accused me of going " behind his back " to steal the rifle from him. I said yes, that's just what I did, and his eyes about popped out of his skull. Then I opened my coat and made sure he saw what I had on my belt, we had a few quiet words that ended the conversation and I spent the next five years stealing out from under that scumbag any rifle I heard he was looking at, or for. I am sure a few slipped past me, but for the most part he had to travel away from home to find what he wanted. It all ended on the side of I-95 someplace in Georgia when local, state, and Federal law enforcement swooped down on him and his trunk full of guns and blow he was running north. Smuggling hand guns into New York was a big no-no back then also, unregistered full auto weapons an even bigger no-no as was the several keys of blow, major distribution weight. Couldn't happen to a nicer guy, I hope he enjoys the special relationships with his fellow inmates that prison life has to offer, I hope he enjoys it several times a day. Every time I look at that Mauser I think of that Bubba, I like to say he started going bad the moment he took a saw to his first milsurp, and look were he ended up.

And the moral of the story is STAY ON JYD's GOOD SIDE!

No kidding! It must have been a lot of work driving down to Fl., slipping some pistols, MAC-10's and some white powdery substance into his trunk, and then tipping off the FBI, JIm.

That Argentine is beautiful,martin!

That is perfect. Really nice.

OP: Very nice rifle. I have both a rifle and carbine in 1909. The carbine is a bit scruffy, but the rifle is fairly nice.

I also have both manufacturer's examples of 1908 Brazil rifles, and a 1935. The Brazil rifles are gorgeous. There is a site somewhere that is chock full of threads about how proud Bubbas are of the job they made of ruining these rifles. I had to stay in the bathroom for two days after reading a couple of the blurbs.

Can't post any pics, as I am not at home.

kjohn wrote:OP: Very nice rifle. I have both a rifle and carbine in 1909. The carbine is a bit scruffy, but the rifle is fairly nice.

I also have both manufacturer's examples of 1908 Brazil rifles, and a 1935. The Brazil rifles are gorgeous. There is a site somewhere that is chock full of threads about how proud Bubbas are of the job they made of ruining these rifles. I had to stay in the bathroom for two days after reading a couple of the blurbs.

Can't post any pics, as I am not at home.

When you get a chance, post up some pics kjohn.

Meanwhile, enjoy the M1909 Cavalry Carbine.