Bore diagnosis

[FineRedMist]

Well, I need to decide how far down this particular 1931 Izhevsk hex receiver rabbit hole to go. Please give an honest opinion to a Mosin Nagant newbie who wants a reasonable shooter without carving up a nice, historical firearm.

I just slugged the barrel for the second time after trying to thoroughly clean the bore with soaks of Hoppe's foaming, nylon brush, and #9 patches. Lands measured .302 in both directions, and grooves measured .3145 x .315. This is the first rifle I've slugged, so I'm not sure how to "read" it besides measuring. The edges of the grooves seem unequally sharp:


Rotated 180 degrees:


Rotated 180 degrees:

I don't know if the pictures are showing what I'm seeing very well: hold the slug in one direction and it appears that the "left" edge of each groove is more sharply defined than the "right." I don't know if that's normal in slugs, but I thought I'd share it.

Next, I think I got a few better bore pics. Is this bore very worn, very corroded, very dirty/fouled, or acceptable given what it is?









I don't want to invest heavily in cast bullets, custom sizing dies, and the rest if this bore is "shot out" or not worth the effort. I'm not looking for 1-2 MOA performance, but I'm not sure I'll have fun at the range or confidence in other situations if groups are a lot bigger than 4-6" at 100 yards when I'm doing my part.

Thoughts?


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[millman]

How does this rifle shoot with surplus, right now?

[FineRedMist]

I haven't shot surplus out of it at all. The factory stuff I did shoot through it was pretty inconsistent, but a front sight that proved to be loose in its dovetail and the big difference between POA and POI, elevation-wise, make it difficult for me to draw many conclusions based on that. I have a minor repair to the front sight underway, and when it's properly fixed in place, I'll give it another run, perhaps including some milsurp, since I've found a place I can shoot FMJ and surplus ammo at 50 yards at least. In the meantime, I've been thinking ahead. After slugging it the first time, I started to ASSume...conventional wisdom seems to be that .310 bullets will be rattling down a .3145-.315 barrel and barely engaging the rifling, so I figured it was going to be wasteful to even spend a lot of time and effort buying or loading stuff that size. But I'm open to learning something new.

[millman]

You have determined that the minor diameter of the bore seems to be about .304. A .310-.312 bullet is hardly gonna rattle down the barrel. I would fire a variety of ammo including all of the different kinds of surplus I could find before I got into casting and or making my own. Like you say this will most likely never be much better than minute of man. I think you are getting ahead of yourself without enough baseline information. Just my

[FineRedMist]

OK, that makes sense. For the moment, then, I'll load some with the bullets I have, shoot some slightly more controlled tests with a variety of factory, reloaded, and surplus ammo, and check back.

Just out of curiosity, if one wants to be able to shoot, say 3 MOA or so, does one have to spend a lot more, either on a single rifle or a mess of random ones (plus all the ammo trying them out) until a good shooter appears? Or can cosmetically less-desirable good shooters still be had for $250 or less?

[millman]

If you want a very good chance for that kind of accuracy, pony up and get a M39. Some 91/30s will shoot that good, but it is a crapshoot as to what you will get. If you really want a tackdriver, go find a Swedish Mauser, or any of the Swiss rifles.

[millman]

Another variable is you. How experienced a shooter are you? Practice will do wonders for group size.

[racerguy00]

I had a great looking refurb with a perfect looking bore shoot 5 inch groups at 100 yards and a ratty looking non refurb with a dark bore shoot 3 inch or less groups all day long. As said, you never know.

[qz2026]

I agree with millman. These rifles weren't designed for 2, 3, or 4 MOA. They were designed for peasants, not marksmen. In most cases, even at 6 MOA, you would likely hit center mass and the guy on the receiving end is out of the fight. But some of these are pretty accurate (accurate enough...) given the shooter is up to the task. I am my accuracy problem sometimes either from my weakened eyes or recoil anticipation. The Finns, Swedes and Swiss had a different perspective and their rifles reflect that.

That front sight is a huge issue. The bore isn't the worst I've seen either. Some of my non refurbs are fairly accurate and some of their bores are similar to yours. I just use surplus 147 grain ammo.

[Rongo]

Fix that front sight & re-try...

[zeebill]

My first comment would be to throw the nylon brush away as this is a Milsurp battle rifle not a Remchester bench rifle. Find some decent surplus and fire the thing at 50 yards for about 100 shots to get used to the heavy report and banging on your shoulder. Do some hot cleaning with the rifle cleaner of your choice at the range after about a dozen shots to get it hot clean the rifle with either a brass brush or as I use a Stainless steel brush. That bore looks like it needs heavy cleaning not a nylon brush tickling it. I don't even own a nylon brush anymore as I shoot only Milsurp rifles and pistols anymore. You can use what ever cleaner you want and after you go home or at the range douse the bore with either hot water or something like Windex to stop the corrosive salts from doing damage to the bore. You also should take the bolt apart and clean the leftovers from the corrosive primers out of there too.

Another thing to keep in mind is these are battle rifles made to hit the mass of the opposing soldier not a gnat on the ear of a fast running squirrel 200 yards away. I find a 5 or 6 inch group with surplus at 100 yards away about average for most rifles I own and shoot. I am 70+ years old and for an old blind bat like me that is good I would guess. Many people have disparaging remarks about the accuracy of a Mosin to there expensive hunting rifle firing $1+ a shot ammo that they may have reloaded them selves. I only say one thing and that is if you think this thing is such a piece of junk go stand out there at 200 yards and lets see how dead you are after a shot or two. That is what they were built and designed to do kill people at a distance and believe me they will do a right good job of doing that. Think of what you paid for the rifle and ammo and what it is capable of doing with practice and that rifle will look more and more like a real bargain. Bill

PS Staking that front sight with a prick punch is what that sight was designed to have done to hold a mark for accuracy.