The Russian Mosin Nagant Forum

Hi fellas; I just picked up a 91/30 a couple days ago and can't seem to determine exactly what it is with my limited knowledge so far.
It is a sniper rifle as it had the scope and bracket on it up until a few days ago, I seen it with my own eyes. The seller had a buyer for the scope and mount and sold it, then I came along and bought the rifle.
It was told to me that it was an original, and looked like it from what I could tell, but I'm no expert. Ive taken a few pics that I'll post here and perhaps someone here can shed some light on it. Some of the markings and stamps have me confused, I think its a 1943 Izhevsyk, but I can also see some Tula markings as well. Then on the barrel there is another stamp that gives the model & caliber, as well as Made In Russia, plus a couple small emblems of some sort. On the tang it appears to have been stamped over with a Tula star. Any help would be greatly appreciated in sorting this out.



I'm having trouble posting more pics I'll try later again.
Photos edited by Dolk

A real PU sniper is an $850 rifle or more, it's very unlikely that someone would strip off the scope and mount from such an investment, however fake PU snipers abound on the market, they are a $400-$450 rifle, and then I can see someone stripping one of them, why would be the mystery. Stripping one fake sniper to make another? That would imply some serious fault with the stripped rifle.

The rifle was at one time a sniper. I can't imagine why anyone would strip a sniper rifle and sell off the mounts and scope unless it was perhaps a ex-sniper that was re-snipered with a fake scope and mount and it didn't matter. But by the time you buy that rifle for $450 and add a real scope and mount, you could have bought a Molot sniper for much less or even a RGUNS sniper. So what would be the point?

Show us a photo of the "import mark" and where it is. That would be interesting to see and will tell a lot.

Dolk

I am wondering why you have only one pic. how about 8-10?

Thanks for the replies so far, I'll try to get a few more pics added to this post.

Brewbrother wrote:I am wondering why you have only one pic. how about 8-10?

I was having some problems getting the pics posted, then I ran out of time as I had to go to work. I have more up now.

Don't know why it would have been stripped, someone had more money than brains maybe?

Total ignorance, what else could it be?

Probably using the parts to fake some other rifle that he will sell for a shitload of money. Nobody would use these as scopes on any other rifle that could otherwise take western optics instead of the commie ones.

Could someone please elaborate on the Molot import, was this the Canadian importer? Were these rifles from the Ukraine? It appears to me that I have an original sniper rifle that is now missing the scope and mount. I could see if the seller I bought it from could put me in touch with the buyer of the scope and mount, then there may be a chance of getting it back together again at some future date.
From what Ive noticed is that the sniper rifles seem to be more available here than the regular infantry rifles. I think that is because of the prices they are selling for. A lot of fellas are happy with just a regular rifle for around $180.00 or less but there are none to be had around here at the moment, and talk is that they are near the end of the supply that is being imported into Canada.
I'm sure the seller I bought mine from just wanted to sell the gun complete, but had no takers at his asking price. When he got an offer to sell the scope and mount separately, he took it.
Thanks again everyone for all your help so far
Steve

Devious6 wrote:In effect, you now have an ex-sniper that you can part together to make back into a representational sniper.

The focus of this forum is on original, non-restored or fixed-up rifles so this isn't the place for discussion of options.

Really,....... this is not the focus of these forums? Although this sniper has had it's optics removed, it is not an Ex-Sniper rifle. It is a sniper rifle with it's optics removed. Although this could be in the "Restoration forum", because of it's uniqueness, it will stay here in the sniper area where "experienced eyes" can and will see it. I don't see this as any different then the Samco snipers without a scope and base, and someone getting the correct optics and putting them on.


The purpose and goals of these forums are determined by all of our members and the Administrators. He has not "altered" this rifle, nor has he Bubba'd it. It is missing parts and those parts can be replaced (carefully) with "original sniper parts" making the rifle as close to what it was when it came out of the arsenals. Yes it will be a "put together, but nothing on the rifle will need to be altered to accomplish that. That is within the goals of these forums.

It is not a re-sniper. The holes are still there from the original drilling (I'm assuming Molot didn't drill these...I hope ). So no "altering of the rifle needs to be done to "restore" it.

I can see why this was done. $350 for the rifle and maybe another $300 for the scope and maybe a $100 for the mount and base. Total (maybe) $750. Right now (current market) it might be profitable to strip down.

Problem: is it worth putting back together?

Dolk

Magellan wrote:Could someone please elaborate on the Molot import, was this the Canadian importer? Were these rifles from the Ukraine? It appears to me that I have an original sniper rifle that is now missing the scope and mount. I could see if the seller I bought it from could put me in touch with the buyer of the scope and mount, then there may be a chance of getting it back together again at some future date.
From what Ive noticed is that the sniper rifles seem to be more available here than the regular infantry rifles. I think that is because of the prices they are selling for. A lot of fellas are happy with just a regular rifle for around $180.00 or less but there are none to be had around here at the moment, and talk is that they are near the end of the supply that is being imported into Canada.
I'm sure the seller I bought mine from just wanted to sell the gun complete, but had no takers at his asking price. When he got an offer to sell the scope and mount separately, he took it.
Thanks again everyone for all your help so far
Steve

Molot is a company same as Mitchel's Mausers is here. They have in the past taken M91/30's and refurbished them and remark them then to call them "hunting rifles". It is possible that this is how they are getting around the import ban from Russia.

They are located in Russia.

Molot somehow (and no one really knows the entire stoory, they just make it up) is involved in this last batch of snipers to come out of Russia. I don't think they are Ukrainian exports, but are form Russia (same rifle). Question is, how much work did Molot so to these snipers. They are not refurbished as any other know snipers coming out of the Ukraine. It is obvious they have been "re-marked" to match at some point. The fonts are modern fonts, so this batch has been "re-furbished" fairly recently. Question is, were the rifles parts and put together and refurbished all by Molot, or not. If they were, then it would be close to what Mitchel's does. If not, then they are arsenal refurbished. Big difference, and no one seems to be tell the entire story. So time will tell. It always does.

At present, we will treat Molot snipers as arsenal refurbished snipers. We have no proof that Molot has done this work like Mitchel's. Or like Century did years ago when they bought parts and assembled snipers.

Question for you is, is it worth the cost to restore this rifle. Yes, it can be done, but only you can say if you are going to keep going or not. It would be great to find the original scope, mount and base, but I'll bet that base will sell for some pretty good money now. It is very hard to find original bases.


To "strip" a viable sniper down for parts is despicable. It is sheer greed, and destroying the rifle's value and history. No worse then refinishing it.

You could hold onto it (it still fires and functions), and at a latter date replace everything if you get more money, or you could sell it off as is. It is a shame, but a fact of life sometimes.

Dolk