1947 M44, looks all original.

[srv1]

Maybe the OP can get some pictures of the right side because you can see part of a letter or number that has been scrubbed. All I'm trying to figure out if this is a Molot or not because if my hunch is correct, I think they are doing some of the stuff to these rifles before they come here to the states. It is a very nice rifle and I do like the bluing but think about it, on what Russian Mosin have you seen bluing this shiny? I'm only asking questions so we can understand more about these especially the M44.

James

[Longcolt44]

Molot or not. This is easy to determine. If it has the Molot banner on the barrel under the top handguard it is.

[Darryl]

Maybe the OP can get some pictures of the right side because you can see part of a letter or number that has been scrubbed. All I'm trying to figure out if this is a Molot or not because if my hunch is correct, I think they are doing some of the stuff to these rifles before they come here to the states. It is a very nice rifle and I do like the bluing but think about it, on what Russian Mosin have you seen bluing this shiny? I'm only asking questions so we can understand more about these especially the M44.

James

What Mosin have I seen the bluing this shinny?.......On just about every Mosin M44 I have seen made after the war. The bluing (and finish) is typical of a post war M44 Mosin. They did a great job after the war was over finishing the M44's. It is why some of the guys like to collect them because of the fine machining and bluing. Nothing new there. There were a few years before the war (and a few during the war) where they had finishing this nice too. In particular, the snipers were all finished a little better then normal (but not always).

Now as far as it being a Molot. I don't know the entire story about the Molots, and no one does.

I haven't seen any indication it is a Molot rifle as yet. If it were it would be easy to spot. Either on the left rear of the receiver or under the hand guard on the top of the barrel. I'd like to see a photo of those two areas, but without them, it's just a wild ass guess.

Dolk

[Darryl]

Look at the "graining" in the metal. All running in one direction and all very consistant all the way through the barrel. That is not scrubbed.

47M44b.jpg

[Marcus]

Photos confirm what I thought I might have seen on the earlier ones - this is not a post-war stock with the dovetailed in toe piece, this is a wartime 1944-45 era stock with a repair to the toe. This is typical of stocks that had some kind of damage or flaw in the wood when they were manufactured - they were set aside, then repaired and used later. You see this sometimes with the 1942-43 style stocks with the "half-liner" sling slot escutcheons that were used on carbines made in 1944 and '45. So an earlier stock like this that was factory repaired and finished, then used on a later rifle, would not be incorrect or improper for a 1947 Mosin.

The numbers stamped on the wood under the buttplate are interesting - they kind of remind me of the ones found on the Yugo issue PU rifles.

As far as post-war Soviet refurbing, whether a rifle needed it or not has nothing to do with whether or not it was done. As part of the typical wasteful Communist "make work" programs, brand new, mint, unissued, rifles were taken from their crates and refurbished.....in the case of most 1947 Izhevsk PU sniper rifles, this unnecessary arsenal Bubba work included turning them into "ex"-snipers.

[srv1]

Maybe the OP can get some pictures of the right side because you can see part of a letter or number that has been scrubbed. All I'm trying to figure out if this is a Molot or not because if my hunch is correct, I think they are doing some of the stuff to these rifles before they come here to the states. It is a very nice rifle and I do like the bluing but think about it, on what Russian Mosin have you seen bluing this shiny? I'm only asking questions so we can understand more about these especially the M44.

James

What Mosin have I seen the bluing this shinny?
Dolk

I do not know, I was asking you if you have. I haven't but you probably seen more Mosin's than I have. What I can tell you is that all of the nice and shiny non-Finn Mosin's I have seen that has a polished blue look, seem to be Molot's. That is just from my experiences with these at shows and gun stores. When I bought my 43 M44 at my LGS, even before I picked it up, I could tell it was a Molot from looking at the bluing and it was. The best way I can describe it is that the bluing is more of a "modern" bluing than the older firearms I have seen. I do not know if that makes any sense but that is the best way I can describe it.

James

[srv1]

Look at the "graining" in the metal. All running in one direction and all very consistant all the way through the barrel. That is not scrubbed.

47M44b.jpg

Maybe it is a lite stamp of the proof marks. Hard to tell from the side. Now that I look at it again, that blur I see as a scrub may be a reflection. Hard to tell. I hope the OP takes the stock of to see what other kinds of stamps are on this.

James

[Longcolt44]

WTF, who really cares if it is a Molot or not. Lee-online bought it, he liked it, he evidently thought we would enjoy it and so he shared it. That is all that matters.

[srv1]

WTF, who really cares if it is a Molot or not. Lee-online bought it, he liked it, he evidently thought we would enjoy it and so he shared it. That is all that matters.

I thought this was a place to talk about Mosin's and learn about them? If all we are going to do is give thumbs up and congrats all the time, we are never going to learn a thing. No one here is bashing his rifle and I'm certainly not. I ask A LOT of questions, that is how I learn. I do not always take one person's word as gospel and leave it at that. Not saying anyone is wrong but sometimes you need to question things in order to learn.

James

[Darryl]

Maybe the OP can get some pictures of the right side because you can see part of a letter or number that has been scrubbed. All I'm trying to figure out if this is a Molot or not because if my hunch is correct, I think they are doing some of the stuff to these rifles before they come here to the states. It is a very nice rifle and I do like the bluing but think about it, on what Russian Mosin have you seen bluing this shiny? I'm only asking questions so we can understand more about these especially the M44.

James

What Mosin have I seen the bluing this shinny?
Dolk

I do not know, I was asking you if you have. I haven't but you probably seen more Mosin's than I have. What I can tell you is that all of the nice and shiny non-Finn Mosin's I have seen that has a polished blue look, seem to be Molot's. That is just from my experiences with these at shows and gun stores. When I bought my 43 M44 at my LGS, even before I picked it up, I could tell it was a Molot from looking at the bluing and it was. The best way I can describe it is that the bluing is more of a "modern" bluing than the older firearms I have seen. I do not know if that makes any sense but that is the best way I can describe it.

James

The finish and bluing on this rifle is typical of a 1947 M44. Your "theory" that all smooth finished rifles and nice bluing have to be Molot doesn't hold up on the post war rifles. Now, having said that, this could be a <olot rifle. If the poster would send photos of the two spots, then we would know. But without that, it just guess work.

Marcus, I have never read anything saying that they didn't use splices on the butt and you could be right. Where did you get the info, I'd like to read a little more on that. On 7.62x54r.net, it has no dates on the spliced toe stock (because he just don't know that) and Tuco says they did use toe splices. I know there must be other places to look, but I have never seen that info. I'd be very interested, as I have two post war M44 myself. But I don't claim they are "all original" either. They may be, but I don't claim it.

"There was another alteration that took place dealing with the stock, as the stock butt was spliced into a two piece arraignment. This was done as it saved on wood and is very common on all postwar made stocks."
Source: Tuco and Vic's site at http://mosinnagant.net/USSR/Russian-M44-Carbine.asp

No mention of spices not being made and installed "Post War"
Source: Ted's site
M44 section: http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinM44S.htm
General Russian stock section: http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinFeatures04.htm

[subscriber]

Can someone please tell me about this rifle, Model etc

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[SA1911a1]

You know, of course, that the OC in the serial stands for Obsessive Compulsive. You went to a gun show and thought you could "just look?"

I went to a show yesterday after a promise to my wife to "keep my hands in my pocket." I kept that promise, when I found the rifle I wanted, I had my son reach into his pocket and pay for it for me. After we left the show, I paid him back. I saw no reason that my wife should have issue with that logic.

[kamakazi339]

beautiful

[redhat10]

Omg, what a beautiful rifle...I would love to find some of these to dig thru and pick up one...Could I ask the price? Condition Excellant...

[Lee-online]

This thread is almot two years old so without checking my bound book i think this m44 cost me $200 otd.
Don't see to many like this at shows anymore so glad i got it when i did.