WeldonHunter wrote:redeuce wrote:Add it up, and something stinks. I think the reason they are cheap is the importer and dealers know there is a problem, and they figure at that price no one will complain. It is also apparent that the biggest support for Molot are the guys that bought the $599 specials, and a forum who's 2 main sponsors are AIM and Classic. I was basically attacked on a board about my stupidity because I had the gall to even question Molot.
Maybe the situation will become clear, but with no cooperation from importer, dealer, or Molot, I doubt it. To me, that means there will always be a question about these.
You bring up some very valid points but I quoted this one specifically because it's also a very valid point. I saw the blind eye that was turned at the possibilities of problems with the Molot PUs. I also saw some given timeouts in conjunction questions about the Molots. You are no idiot. I'd say the ones that fail to question the origin of rifles, that are popping up seemly out of nowhere all of a sudden, are the idiots.
I have a dark, and suspicious mind, some would say even paranoid, it comes from many years of playing this game, I have seen bullshit come and go, and have learned to trust my instincts. Once upon a time selling millsurps was a profitable business with a limited customer base, mostly Bubbas looking for a cheap project rifle. They bought cheap overseas, and sold them for a small profit here, nobody got rich but there was food on the table. In the last 15 years milsurp collecting has exploded, it's now mainstream among the gun culture instead of the quiet backwater it was in the past. Popular Hollywood movies, cable TV documentaries, books, have all sparked an intrest in recent history ( 1870-1970) suddenly everybody wants to own one of the relics of history. This in effect sparked a huge growth spurt in the business of dealing military surplus, couple that with the fall of the wall in the east, and the pent up flood of 60+ years of milsurp firearms packed away behind it and you had a golden time of surplus selection like never in history since the fabled days of Bannerman Arms. For a time importers could get anything they wanted dirt cheap from cash starved countries and blow it out on the US market making a huge profit not from markup but from volume sales. Like all good things this came to an end as supplies dwindled, countries once poor regained some financial footing and charged more for what they had left to sell, however demand in the US has not slowed, it's increased. Now you have a situation were there is demand for a product, a great deal of money to be made, and limited supply of that product. Importers are going to do whatever they must to survive, and downsizing isn't part of that plan. I don't question the Balkan type 53's at all, they look exactly like what they are, issued rifles, milsurps without question, dings, scrapes, rust, crud, all expected of such. However when I see something like these Molots,. something almost tailor made to set milsurp collectors, especially newer milsurp collectors salivating like me over a bacon sandwich, alarm bells start going off. I lack trust were I see a powerfull financial motive on the part of a seller, I also lack trust when I feel same sellers are not being candid and forthcoming with the background of what they are selling. Their target market is the collector, collectors by nature want to know everything about what they collect, the backstory is a major selling point. The background of the Ukrainian refurbs has never been held secret, we know were the rifles came from, why they were there, who put them there, who refurbished them. The entire story of the Cold War Soviet weapons stash has been a major selling point for these weapons, everybody wanting a piece of WWIII that never was, none of it was ever kept a secret. Now all of a sudden there are secrets, why? Sellers are avoiding questions, ignoring questions, rude behavior that would guarantee my walking away from them on the spot. If you were buying sausage and asked the butcher what was in it and he refused to answer I am betting that the sausage would remain with him rather than go home with you.
Paranoid? You bet your ass, milsurps are about money now more than ever, people making a great deal of money trading in them who all have a powerfull motivation to get product whereever and however they can. What bothers me is that there is no reason to be dishonest about it, or be secretive. There has always been a thriving market for reproduction milsurps, The M1 carbine was reproduced as early as the 1950's when the real one was still in service, M1 Garands, and M14 , the AR15 and AK47 are all reproduced as new rifles and sell very well. If these Molots were built from parts then why not say so? Molot calls them Hunting rifles, I don't think they are lying, they had to do more than just wipe off some grease or do a quick rebluing job to get these past the import restrictions in place against importing milsurps from Russia itself. This is the most anti gun administration in recent history, if they allowed them in then they had to convince the government that they were indeed sporting rifles no matter what they looked like. That would imply to me that major work of some sort was done, probably using spare parts that I am sure the USSR had in abundance, this is after all the home country of the Mosin, and Molot is part of what was once the largest government arsenal in the USSR, and the most prolific producer of Mosins in history.
When I am not being told the straight story then I must fill in the blanks myself, I take Molot at their word, these are reproduction milsurps, not historical rifles any more. The history may have been wiped off them, but they are still good shooters, and available at reasonable cost, however a collector should know what they are buying. If it's history you want buy a Balkan M91, lots of history there, or a Soviet Ukrainian hoard Mosin, history of a different kind there as well. If you like to shoot then the Molot is for you, some of us shoot so much we set stocks on fire ( you know who you are) The Molot is said to have a bore like brand new, perfect crown, no issues with headspace that I have yet heard about ( but check anyway) and they look very nice, it sounds like the perfect Mosin shooter, and if I was to buy one this is what I would buy it for. I would buy it as a sporting rifle, not a piece of history, unless Molot came right out on Sunday and told the world that they were selling rifles that had been on ice in the former USSR for the last 60 years. Now if they did that the news would be huge, collectors would fall over themselves to own one, they could double the price and still sell them, maybe triple it. However they aren't saying all that are they?
If you want to buy a Molot then buy one, the cost is not excessive, it will make a perfectly good shooter and good firearms are always worth having , but consider it as a representation of history rather that a relic of it, and don't get upset if boards like this one that are all about history rather than reproduction place the Molots in the sporting rifle category. We have a sporting rifle section were sporting rifles are shown off. If I ever take pics of my reproduction M1 carbine that's were you will see it, or my Century FAL, or Maddi AK. Unless new information should come to light about them, but we all know the current administration, there is just no way these rifles were just taken out of crates in storage and sent here, the administration would burn in hell first before it lifted a firearms restriction.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
I doubt you are. Reason dictates questions at least to me, therefore reasons dictate I am an idiot also.
over your collection.
