I never realized it was possible to reline a barrel. Is this common?
Any idea what the E stamped on the bolt near the handle means?
Showcase submission Finnish M91
Re: Showcase submission Finnish M91
Vintage Paul
A man with a watch always knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure.
A man with a watch always knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure.
Re: Showcase submission Finnish M91
New england i think. The relining happens in other weapons like the vetterli, SKS has a chrome lining ...so forth. I aslo think some carcanos had been relined. 
The commerce which maybe carried on with the people inhabiting the line you will pursue renders a knowledge of these people important ~Thomas Jefferson~ (to- Lewis and Clark)
Re: Showcase submission Finnish M91
The Finns got the technology/know how to do it from the Italians. Relined M91 Carcano rifles are common. They have "tubata" stamped on the barrel.desdem12 wrote:New england i think. The relining happens in other weapons like the vetterli, SKS has a chrome lining ...so forth. I aslo think some carcanos had been relined.
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Flyin Brian
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Re: Showcase submission Finnish M91
I've got a few with that flat section on the bottom of the barrel. I think the first one I saw was an 1894 Izhevsk that is wearing a 1906 receiver. Interesting stuff and very nice rifle!!
Re: Showcase submission Finnish M91
Thanks Brian. It has been speculated that the big flat on the underside of the barrel had something to do with the rebarreling process. It seems that all of the P-series rifle have one, and it would make sense that an 1894 on a 1906 receiver (obviously rebarreled) would have one as well. Got any pics?Flyin Brian wrote:I've got a few with that flat section on the bottom of the barrel. I think the first one I saw was an 1894 Izhevsk that is wearing a 1906 receiver. Interesting stuff and very nice rifle!!
“Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.” George Orwell, English novelist, essayist, and critic, 1903-1950
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis
Re: Showcase submission Finnish M91
Millman,
I love mysteries. I also have a P series. I'll have to pull it apart to see whether it also has the milled area.
No question this is a showcase rifle.
Madison
I love mysteries. I also have a P series. I'll have to pull it apart to see whether it also has the milled area.
No question this is a showcase rifle.
Madison
MN#1 - Finnish M39 - 1941 - More when it arrives ...
Re: Showcase submission Finnish M91
Millman,
A statement early in your post on this rifle got under my skin. I felt I owed you a follow-up response. I'm talking about the 'big time' collectors that have told you this is not a P series rifle because P-26 or P-27 isn't stamped on the barrel. That makes about as much sense as to claim some of the post-war Finn rfles are not M-39s because the Sako, VKT, or Tikka logo isn't on the barrel. My gosh, some don't even show the year of production.
Sorry, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, its a duck regardless of whether someone cant figure out what kind of bird it is.
The P-xx designation was put on the barrels to make it easy to identify M-91 barels relined using the Salerno process. The fact they we're relined was far more important than the stamp on the barrel. Correct me if I'm wrong but the only period in Finnish Mosen Nagant history when the Salerno process was used was 1925-1927. That's it. Your rifle is a duck.
I can think of two reasons why yours may not have a P marking. You have already mentioned one. Your rifle might be an early 'proof of concept prototype. When the decision was made to start stamping these relined barrels, your barrel was out in the field for testing or was tucked away somewhere forgotten.
The other possibility is that your rifle was produced near the end of the run. The champion of this approach was Colonel Saloranta, director of the Finn AV-1 Arms depot. Apparently he got sideways with someone above him in the organization chart. He lost the ensuing political battle. His barrels were judged to be inferior, Saloranta was demoted, and his pay was docked for the arsenal money he 'wasted' on this technique.
Why would you stamp the last group of barels when they were headed for the scrap heap anyway? But the Finns kept the 'inferior' barrels. When they started to run short of barrels during the Winter War, they re-evaluated the P barrels and found them to be acceptable.
This is all documented in my post on my own P-26.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=3694
Let me reiterate what I said earlier. This duck belongs in the showcase and I'm glad to see it there.
Madison
A statement early in your post on this rifle got under my skin. I felt I owed you a follow-up response. I'm talking about the 'big time' collectors that have told you this is not a P series rifle because P-26 or P-27 isn't stamped on the barrel. That makes about as much sense as to claim some of the post-war Finn rfles are not M-39s because the Sako, VKT, or Tikka logo isn't on the barrel. My gosh, some don't even show the year of production.
Sorry, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, its a duck regardless of whether someone cant figure out what kind of bird it is.
The P-xx designation was put on the barrels to make it easy to identify M-91 barels relined using the Salerno process. The fact they we're relined was far more important than the stamp on the barrel. Correct me if I'm wrong but the only period in Finnish Mosen Nagant history when the Salerno process was used was 1925-1927. That's it. Your rifle is a duck.
I can think of two reasons why yours may not have a P marking. You have already mentioned one. Your rifle might be an early 'proof of concept prototype. When the decision was made to start stamping these relined barrels, your barrel was out in the field for testing or was tucked away somewhere forgotten.
The other possibility is that your rifle was produced near the end of the run. The champion of this approach was Colonel Saloranta, director of the Finn AV-1 Arms depot. Apparently he got sideways with someone above him in the organization chart. He lost the ensuing political battle. His barrels were judged to be inferior, Saloranta was demoted, and his pay was docked for the arsenal money he 'wasted' on this technique.
Why would you stamp the last group of barels when they were headed for the scrap heap anyway? But the Finns kept the 'inferior' barrels. When they started to run short of barrels during the Winter War, they re-evaluated the P barrels and found them to be acceptable.
This is all documented in my post on my own P-26.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=3694
Let me reiterate what I said earlier. This duck belongs in the showcase and I'm glad to see it there.
Madison
MN#1 - Finnish M39 - 1941 - More when it arrives ...